Posts by Steve J

5

Acts 15. What is meant by Fornication

by Steve J in

at atcs 15 we find the familir decision of the jerusalem elders;.

keep abstaining from things sacrificed to idols and from blood and from things strangled and from fornication.. i have always thought that fornication, or sexual imorality was a strage thing for the elders to come up with here, when they were obviously talking about issues surrounding worshiping "false gods.

could it be that the greek word porneiahas been misinterpreted here and actually refers to religious fornication in the same sense as found at rev:14,8 17:2,4 18:3 and 19:2, where the great harlot commits fornication?

Steve J

At Atcs 15 we find the familir decision of the Jerusalem Elders;

Keep abstaining from things sacrificed to idols and from blood and from things strangled and from fornication.

I have always thought that fornication, or sexual imorality was a strage thing for the Elders to come up with here, when they were obviously talking about issues surrounding worshiping "false gods."

Could it be that the Greek word Porneiahas been misinterpreted here and actually refers to religious fornication in the same sense as found at Rev:14,8 17:2,4 18:3 and 19:2, where the Great Harlot commits fornication?

9

Deuteronomy 32:7-9 Who is the Most High?

by Steve J in

please excuse me if you've discussed this topic before, but as a "newbie" i haven't found anything on it as yet.. 7 remember the days of old, consider the years back from generation to generation; ask your father and he can tell you; your old men and they can say it to you.

8 when the most high gave the nations an iheritance, when he parted the sons of adam fron one another, he proceeded to fix the boundary of the peoples with regard for the sons of israel.

9 for jehovah's share is his people; jacob is the allotment that he inherits.

Steve J

Hi Mouthy,

We HAD all the Knowledge The WT wanted us to know

Good point, but I beg to differ on the previous statement;

But KNOWLEDGE puffs up

I firmly believe with true knowledge comes humility and the more you get to know, you find the more there is to know.

Thanks for your kind words anyway.

Steve J

9

Deuteronomy 32:7-9 Who is the Most High?

by Steve J in

please excuse me if you've discussed this topic before, but as a "newbie" i haven't found anything on it as yet.. 7 remember the days of old, consider the years back from generation to generation; ask your father and he can tell you; your old men and they can say it to you.

8 when the most high gave the nations an iheritance, when he parted the sons of adam fron one another, he proceeded to fix the boundary of the peoples with regard for the sons of israel.

9 for jehovah's share is his people; jacob is the allotment that he inherits.

Steve J

Hi Leolaia & Narkissos,

Thanks for the info and the link to your previous discussion, I found it fascinating to see how the text was revised to fit more comfortably with a monotheistic faith. I especially liked your post about the Canaanite god El and him having 70 sons and how this seems to fit with Genesis 10 and the 70 nations, but this has left me with even more questions, which might seem obvious to you, but here goes;

Is there a link between El and Elohim of Genesis 1 and do you believe the Creation account there is based on Canaanite mythology?

I have also found other suggestions of polytheism in ancient Israel, such as Josephus writing about Abram. that "he was the first man to publish the notion that there was but one God, the Creator of the universe." (Antiquities Bk.1 Ch VII.1)

This would certainly suggest that before Abram other gods were worshiped apart from YHWH wouldn't it?

And what about the Teraphim, which I believe were Semetic house-gods?

We know from the Hebrew Scriptures they were tollerated by Jacob and his descendants right up until the time of King Josiah and probably later. It seems then that a polytheistic belief was nothing new to the Israelites then was it?

One final point was to do with something Narkissos said in the previous discussion that I picked up on;

In Semitic languages, a son of (a) god is basically a god, just as a son of (a) man is a man.

In looking at the Greek Scriptures afresh, I haven't as yet, come accross an instance where Jesus ever refers to himself as the "Son of God," but on numerous occasions he refers to himself as the "Son of Man," which suggests to me that he was emphasising his motality. What did the title "Son of Man" mean?

Like many JW's I once thought I had a fairly good knowledge of the Scriptures.

Laughable isn't it?

But since leaving and approaching them as if for the first time, I've been amazed at how little I actually knew about the Bible. Like many I think I've learned so much more since getting out and am really enjoying my own research now and finding these new thoughts.

At the moment I don't know what to believe, but I'm certainly enjoying the freedom.

Thanks again

Steve J

9

Deuteronomy 32:7-9 Who is the Most High?

by Steve J in

please excuse me if you've discussed this topic before, but as a "newbie" i haven't found anything on it as yet.. 7 remember the days of old, consider the years back from generation to generation; ask your father and he can tell you; your old men and they can say it to you.

8 when the most high gave the nations an iheritance, when he parted the sons of adam fron one another, he proceeded to fix the boundary of the peoples with regard for the sons of israel.

9 for jehovah's share is his people; jacob is the allotment that he inherits.

Steve J

Please excuse me if you've discussed this topic before, but as a "Newbie" I haven't found anything on it as yet.

7 Remember the days of old, Consider the years back from generation to generation; ask your father and he can tell you; your old men and they can say it to you. 8 When the Most High gave the nations an iheritance, When he parted the sons of Adam fron one another, He proceeded to fix the boundary of the peoples with regard for the sons of Israel. 9 For Jehovah's share is his people; Jacob is the allotment that he inherits. 10 He came to find him in a wilderness land, And in an empty, howling desert. He began to encircle him, to take care of him, To safegaurd him as the pupil of his eye. 11 Just as an eagle stirs up its nest, Hovers over its fledglings. Spreads out its wings, takes them, Carries them on its pinions, 12 Jehovah alone kept leading him, And there was no foreign god along with him. (Deut 23:7-9. NWT)

Here in the "Song of Moses," verse 9 tells us "Jehovah's share is his people; Jacob is the allotment that he inherits."

The dictionary definition of "inherit," is; "To receive by legal descent or succession. Derive from ones parents or ancestors. Succeed as an heir."

In verse 8 it seems to be the "Most High," who aportioned the nations.

Does this suggest that the Most High and Jehovah are two seperate individuals and Jehovah inherited Jacob from the Most High?

Steve J

11

Matt 5:17-20. What does it mean to be called least in the kingdom?

by Steve J in

hi folks,.

as this seems to be the only place to get my questions answered, (and i've got lots of them) i thought i'd give this one a try.. when speaking about the commandments at matthew 5:17-20 jesus said any who break one of the least of these and teaches others to that effect would be called least in the kingdom of the heavens.

does it mean there is still hope for such ones, as being considered least would suggest to me that you would still be remembered.. also, at 1 corinthinas 6:9 where the apostle paul says fornicators and adulterers, (those who break the commandments) will not inherit the kingdom is he taking a harder line than jesus and in effect contradicting him?.

Steve J

You'll have to forgive me Joseph, but you've given me a whole new line of thought.

For some time now I have thought Paul was the apostate, because he was so scathing of the Jerusalem Elders and apostles, in scriptures such as Gal 2:1-9 & Phil 3:2-4.

Also, at 1Cor 10:25-30, where Paul tells the Corinthian congregation not to worry too much about what they buy in the meat market, he seems to me, to be contradicting the Jerusalem Elders again and their decision found at Acts 15:28,29.

If the Jerusalem Elders were the true apostates though this would put a whole new light on the matter.

How though do we now view the letters of Peter, James and John? Do they have any place in the Scriptures if they are the work of apostates and what about The Revelation, what are we to make of that?

Steve J

11

Matt 5:17-20. What does it mean to be called least in the kingdom?

by Steve J in

hi folks,.

as this seems to be the only place to get my questions answered, (and i've got lots of them) i thought i'd give this one a try.. when speaking about the commandments at matthew 5:17-20 jesus said any who break one of the least of these and teaches others to that effect would be called least in the kingdom of the heavens.

does it mean there is still hope for such ones, as being considered least would suggest to me that you would still be remembered.. also, at 1 corinthinas 6:9 where the apostle paul says fornicators and adulterers, (those who break the commandments) will not inherit the kingdom is he taking a harder line than jesus and in effect contradicting him?.

Steve J

At Galatians 5:2-4 Paul also says; "If you become circumcised, Christ will be of no benefit to you."

Why then as recorded at Acts 16: 1-3 did Paul circumcise the Gentile Timothy himself?

I realise that verse 3 tells us it was because of the Jews in Lystra and Iconium, but this still doesn't explain why Paul didn't make a stand on the issue if he believed circumcision was so wrong. It suggests that Paul was practicing double standards here.

Steve J

11

Matt 5:17-20. What does it mean to be called least in the kingdom?

by Steve J in

hi folks,.

as this seems to be the only place to get my questions answered, (and i've got lots of them) i thought i'd give this one a try.. when speaking about the commandments at matthew 5:17-20 jesus said any who break one of the least of these and teaches others to that effect would be called least in the kingdom of the heavens.

does it mean there is still hope for such ones, as being considered least would suggest to me that you would still be remembered.. also, at 1 corinthinas 6:9 where the apostle paul says fornicators and adulterers, (those who break the commandments) will not inherit the kingdom is he taking a harder line than jesus and in effect contradicting him?.

Steve J

Hi again,

Thanks for your replies,

Joseph, you say;

In Matt 5:19 we are taught that breaking the law and teaching others to break the law is destructive enough to prevent us entering the kingdom. This makes us a goat. It is like a sin against the holy spirit

Rocky said;

Jesus has the highest regard for God's law and encourages others to have such also. In fact he says; "Whoever, therefore, breaks one of these least commandments and teaches mankind to that effect, he will be called 'least' in relation to the kingdom of the heavens," meaning that such a person would not inherit the kingdom at all."

But where does that leave Paul?

Jehovah gave the Israelites the law, which had many health benefits. Modern science has shown how benificial circumcision is for instance, as it helps prevent the spread of many infections. However, circumcision predates the law, as it was a vital part of the Abramic Covenant, as well as the Mosaic Law yet Paul openly taught there was no need for Gentile worshipers to get circumcised, or keep the law. Does that mean Paul was a goat then and will not inherit the kingdom?

As followers of Jesus the Jew, who was himself circumcised on the 8th day, and upheld the law to the letter, I believe we should all attempt to live as he did and if there are so many benifits to be gained from circumcision, I can't understand why Paul was so opposed to it. Surely Jehovah and Jesus knew best?

Steve J

11

Matt 5:17-20. What does it mean to be called least in the kingdom?

by Steve J in

hi folks,.

as this seems to be the only place to get my questions answered, (and i've got lots of them) i thought i'd give this one a try.. when speaking about the commandments at matthew 5:17-20 jesus said any who break one of the least of these and teaches others to that effect would be called least in the kingdom of the heavens.

does it mean there is still hope for such ones, as being considered least would suggest to me that you would still be remembered.. also, at 1 corinthinas 6:9 where the apostle paul says fornicators and adulterers, (those who break the commandments) will not inherit the kingdom is he taking a harder line than jesus and in effect contradicting him?.

Steve J

Hi folks,

As this seems to be the only place to get my questions answered, (and I've got lots of them) I thought I'd give this one a try.

When speaking about the commandments at Matthew 5:17-20 Jesus said any who break one of the least of these and teaches others to that effect would be called least in the kingdom of the heavens. What did he mean by least?

Does it mean there is still hope for such ones, as being considered least would suggest to me that you would still be remembered.

Also, at 1 Corinthinas 6:9 where the Apostle Paul says fornicators and adulterers, (those who break the commandments) will not inherit the kingdom is he taking a harder line than Jesus and in effect contradicting him?

Thanks

Steve J

22

Are the Creative days 7000 years long?

by Steve J in

where does the idea that the creative days of the genesis account were 7,000 years long come from?.

genesis doesn't suggest that they were specific time periods, but shows that one "day" extended into others.

i feel that the clue is in the words; "and there was an evening and there was a morning, a first day.

Steve J

Hi ya all,

Thanks for all your post and for clearing that up for me. The question arose because we had some JW friends call the other day and they still seem to believe that the creative days were 7000 years. They also believe that as we're nearing the end of God's rest, we are all about to die...That's if we don't return to the "truth" of course and repent of our sins...

Well, there aint much hope for me then!

It looks like the rest of you are doomed too. Ha! Ha!

Thanks again

Steve J

22

Are the Creative days 7000 years long?

by Steve J in

where does the idea that the creative days of the genesis account were 7,000 years long come from?.

genesis doesn't suggest that they were specific time periods, but shows that one "day" extended into others.

i feel that the clue is in the words; "and there was an evening and there was a morning, a first day.

Steve J

Where does the idea that the Creative Days of the Genesis account were 7,000 years long come from?

Genesis doesn't suggest that they were specific time periods, but shows that one "day" extended into others. I feel that the clue is in the words; "And there was an evening and there was a morning, a first day."

I know the Hebrews reckoned their day as starting from evening, but surely this was much later than the Creation account and an idea based on Genesis. As far as I know they were the only people to adopt this idea, so why do people believe they were specific periods of 7,000 years?